About Michael Travesser
From Prudence Welch
I am writing this as a public
declaration.
I was in the Lord Our Righteousness church for 18
years and just left approximately a year ago.
Click the following Titles to read more:
Hello Julie,
I truly appreciate being able to read the letter from you against me, that was posted on the Prudence attack page. I do not appreciate it because of the content, but because you have never, ever, spoken with me about these things, but it is evident that you have quite a strong opinion, as strong as you say that my opinion is. I would say this: Julie, why did you not speak to me in person, ever, about your offenses, but you would only speak to the world? What good would it have done to talk to you? Would you have repented? No, you are always the “right one” Wayne. You are a true-blue manipulator. It’s your way or the highway (or hell, however you want to put it).
Should I not be privileged to face my accuser? You never once told me these things to my face, or in writing. Not one single time. So now, you go to the public airwaves to spread your stories, almost completely erroneous in regard to the context. Some of your information is plainly untrue. You accuse me of hitting on W. before she was married. What a pure falsehood. It was told to me by the person that reprimanded you. What you were doing with Wendy was seen by several people there. I don’t believe you are telling the truth. You never once asked me if these things were true. Would you have admitted it? Julie, do not the Scriptures say that if one has an offense that they should go to the one that they are offended in? Then, if he does not hear, take another one with you. Then, if he does not hear, bring the matter before the church? Isn't that right Julie? So why did you not come to me? And why did you refuse to visit with me when I offered? So now you pretend to keep the scriptures. What about: But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, causes her to become an adulteress, and anyone who marries the divorced woman commits adultery; or
Do not have sexual relations with your daughter-in-law. She is your son’s wife; or You shall not commit adultery; or You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife. You were always a stickler about the 4th commandment to honor the Sabbath day but you have disregarded the 7th and the 10th commandments.
Eighteen years, Julie. Eighteen years? And you never said anything to me in eighteen years? If I knew this 18 years ago, I wouldn’t have been here that long. It’s only been the last year I’ve come to see what you are doing. I have not held back but told everything plainly to my husband. Please excuse me, but something sounds very strange here. You accuse me of deception, but I think it was you who were deceiving me. You, Prudence, and others, have plainly put together a wonderful fabrication and distortion, to support your very offended hearts. You speak of "taking a hit." Julie, the only time you may have "taken a hit" was when you told me that you were falling in love with me, and out of love with your husband. Remember Julie? Remember, I told you to go back to your husband and be a good wife. Is that not true, Julie? Yes, it is absolutely true. I wanted to have nothing to do with another man's wife. Well, you went back to your husband and that was just what I asked you to do. You have managed to cover all your bases, Wayne. We all know, those of us who spent many hours in meetings, that you did tell us to go back to our husbands, but that was not your intention. And you openly stated this. That was another one of your little reverse psychologies. Your true intention was for the wives to leave their husbands and come to you. You would still always have your alibi - “I told them to go back to their husbands”. Remember, you always set the 2 witnesses up as an example to follow, and they left their husbands.
But there is another aspect to this and since you’ve opened it up let’s talk about it. Yes, (seemingly) falling in love with you was what happened with all the women including myself. It was very short lived though. This led me to see that it was purely a response to the attentions you were giving to me and the other women. And I considered all these things after I stopped going to the meetings. You said it was such a miracle - the witnesses leaving their husbands. But what happened is that you stole the affections of the wives right out in front of the husband’s noses. I witnessed it and experienced it myself. You repeatedly told the husbands that they needed to give their wives over to you and you meant it. I realized that if any man on this earth stood up and said and did the things you did, the women would have fallen in love with him, left their husbands, and would want to sleep with him. Men become rock stars to “get the chicks”. You just became a star in your own mind and projected that to everyone else.
You sure seem to know a whale of a lot about my motives without ever once having spoken with me about them. Does that not seem a little strange, even to you? You also seem to know the motivations of people. Do you think you are the only one that understands how people work? You seem to know all about me, but you have never asked me. How is it that you know so much now, when I have not told you? How is it you know so much without being told?
And Julie, for years, over and over again, I said to ask Father, the God of heaven, if I am who I say that I am. Everyone went and asked God, and everyone was satisfied that God told them that I came from Him. Was not this true? Yes, it was true. So God either told you that I was from Him, or you lied in order to stay here with us. Which was it Julie? Did you lie, or did God tell you I was from Him? No, he did not tell me. I trusted your testimony. It is your fruit and not your words that tell me you are false now. In the old days you would be called a "smooth talker". You have the ability to convince people that what you are doing is of God even when you are swiping their wife right out from under them. It wasn't until last year when the vision (at that time) was for you to have sexual relations with the seven young women that I saw you were really off base. This is important to me. Did your friend Prudence lie to me also? She was asked years ago, as you were, to go ask God also. If I am a deceiver, then why didn't your God tell you? Shecaniah told me a story a few years ago. The Father in heaven told her to go see you in your little retreat. When she got there, you plainly told her that it was not God that told her to go there. So, how does she know which voice is true? You have made it so that they don’t even know which voice is true. They only listen to the voice that comes out of your mouth without any rhyme or reason - even when it’s against the very scriptures they have claimed to follow.
And Julie, why is it that Helen still has a husband and children, and she and her husband David, happily come to meetings when we have them? She is rejoicing daily for her deliverance. How could this be if I told everyone to leave their husbands or wives? You are simply becoming a victim of your illusions. Vickie left her husband and children to live on the land 2 years ago at the bidding of your posts. She finally went back to live with her husband because she missed him. She also told me that her and David wanted to live on the land and your instruction to them was that they could if they put their children in foster care. Another family told me that that was your instruction to them also. You want to know weird, that is weird. If she wants to be a part of your manipulations and in agreement with you sleeping with the girls, that’s fine. I do not. I am rejoicing in my deliverance also.
I spoke with your husband a little bit ago. He read your letter of accusation also. He told me that you are not reporting things as they happened between you and him. You have distorted things he has said, to be something other than what they were. I have witnesses that testify to the truth of what I am saying. He also told me you stole some tools from him when you left, that you had promised to give back. Julie, is stealing okay with you? Stealing? It’s called division of property. He gave all his carpentry tools (25 years worth), his car and his money to who? TO YOU. I kept the router to use here. He didn’t need it there since he has internet. Besides, Terry kept plenty of things. If I could have kept it all, I would have. I have no interest in supporting you in any manner. I’ve done that long enough.
Here’s a question for you? Is stealing ok with you? You accuse me of stealing a $75 router when you have stolen my companion and friend.
And not just mine, but many other companions. He was my helper and friend for 16 years. He was of far more value to me than a $75 router.
You say, “I haven’t stolen him, he left of his own accord”. You are a liar, Wayne. I know how you did it. You can get away with it with those that don’t understand what happened and those that willingly cover their eyes, but I know.
Also, since we’re on the subject, Terry asked me if he could have our electric blanket if I didn’t have a need for it. I told him that I do. I get cold sleeping by myself in the winter, even here. I would suggest that since my husband gave you everything he owns that you buy an electric blanket for him for the winter - since he will be sleeping, as many do, in an unheated facility. Oh, and one more thing, just so we can be clear and honest. I told Terry that I wanted the set of speakers but he really wanted them. He was in the process of getting the Jeep ready to sell. I told him to buy himself a new set when he sold the Jeep. He said “I can’t, because the money is all Wayne’s” So maybe, you could throw in a set of speakers too. Expensive ones, not the cheapies. Thanks!!
Is your theft okay, but my "crimes" not okay? He also stated that he didn't leave your house because of me, or because of anything I said. Oh no, of course not!! He told me that he left because your spirit had changed. A darkness had come over you, and he had to leave that darkness behind. He said that you were an enemy of his family, and he could not live with that any longer. Yes, he left because I dared to openly go against what you were doing. And that you call darkness.
Dear Julie, you accuse me of deception, but it is you who are guilty of that. I have deceived no one, but you have. This is a very sorry thing on my heart for you. Please, spare me. You have a very fine act. Cannot you just be honest, and tell the truth, without making up all of these fabricated distortions? Is Prudence, your "best friend," your new cult leader now? I wonder this because Prudence seems fixated on cults.
Julie, I found no fault in you for leaving us. I never once accosted you about it. I never even one single time, told you that you were evil. No, not once. I have always said to the people, and you know this, "I want you to follow your heart." "Do what you want." And I was content with letting you do what you wanted. But Julie, I didn't mean lie, distort, and hide from the truth of things. I never said to be a devil. I never meant for you to go into hell and spread falsehoods. I said that one should always do what God told him to do. This is true, isn't it Julie? Yes, it is true.
Elisha shared that you have always been afraid. Everyone out there is afraid of you. That’s why A. said she needed to be naked with you, to get over her fears. But I’m not afraid of you anymore. You’re just a skinny little old man that is extremely long winded and with an ego and an imagination that’s just as long. Isn't it true that "perfect love casts out all fear?" Is fear part of the god you have now? I never, ever, taught you to be afraid. I do not believe in fearing. So why am I blamed for that? How is it that you blame me for things that I have never, ever, done to you? What is motivating you? I have never, ever, confronted you about anything. I never have until this very day. I never, ever, told your husband to leave you, or that you should leave him. You are so full of BS it’s incredible. So, are you telling me that is wasn’t you that wrote the posts? In fact, I told you to stay with him. Is that not true? I have never made the doctrine of leaving one's spouse. I have only said that one should divorce his offenses. One should leave the fighting and tension. The reality and the fruit of everything you have said is that no one on the land has an earthly spouse. They have only done as you have preached. Are you lying, even to yourself? Yes, I did say one should divorce from those things. So why are you making up all of your phantoms and accusing me of them? Why? I have never, ever, treated you in a way that would cause fear. Little children love me, and NO, I have not molested them. Children do not love someone they are afraid of, but you have not loved me, evidenced by your fear of me.
So why do you accuse me of things, that you are actually guilty of? That is, "sneaking around making people believe things that are untrue." It is you who are doing that, not I. I tell everyone exactly what I do and I invite anyone, anytime, to come and speak to me about anything. Do you do this Julie? No, you don't do this. You hide and spread "evil surmising." Is evil surmising okay in your new religion, Julie, the religion of Prudence? Have you joined the church of Prudence? Old friend, you think you have left the cult of fear, but you have only joined it. No, my dear, I haven’t. You have given a false view of life to your flock, especially to the young children, in order to keep them in bondage. When you hosted those men who came to put signs on our fence, to curse us, you acted from a dark spirit and not the spirit of Christ. I have written the men who came, and none of them will answer me. They are hiding in a crack somewhere because their evil deeds were exposed. This little episode amazed me. I had nothing to do with the men writing the curses against you. The amazing thing was the offense I saw coming from you and my dear husband. You have cursed the world and waited for the plagues to fall on it for its wickedness for years now. And yet, when 2 men come with signs to curse you for your wickedness and call down the plagues - my oh my, it couldn’t possibly be true. What I did was give the men a place to rest, that’s all. And so, at the very time you are praying for the end of the world, the plagues to fall on all mankind, and for your own translation - 2 men come and put a sign of curses on your gate. So what happened? Did the world end? no Did the plagues fall? no Did you translate? no. You make up stories that these things happen but they really don’t. The reality of what you received was 2 men came and cursed you. So make up your stories. You might have taken it down in 10 minutes but the truth is that God isn’t a respecter of persons, not even you. And he’s not superstitious. If a man does wickedly he will get what he gets. Hitler and Stalin went on their murderous way for quite a long time before they were stopped. A thunderbolt didn’t come down and hit them on the head. They could not even be honest and open, but they had to sneak down the road in the dark with their lights off. But Father awakened one to go see, and we observed the whole sneaky affair. She always wakes up at that time in the morning. When they saw my little flashlight coming, they ran off into the night slithering away in the darkness. God told me right then, "They have cursed whom I have not cursed so their curse will be upon their own heads." Their sign lasted about 10 minutes. The Father alerted us against their voodoo, and said that their voodoo would go upon their own heads.
Julie, whether or not you belong to my church is not a concern to me, but I would very much love for you to find Christ. Yes, anywhere, Christ is a fire. Jesus said that he turned households against each other. You have said that anyone can make the scriptures say what they want and that is what you have done also. He said he came to bring a fire. It is not enjoyable to the flesh to receive Christ. It is sometimes a terror to the flesh, but I would wish upon you this holy terror of the Son of God. With it comes security, fearlessness, and openness. I would very much wish upon you an honest heart instead of the one you now possess. I would wish the same things for Prudence also. When you know God, you will know all about me then, instead of the manufactured vision of me that comes from the dark world below. Be honest, old friend, and return your husband's tools to him. Stealing is not the way to heaven. No, Wayne, that’s true. Stealing isn’t the way to heaven. And you have stolen much. You have stolen the affection of wives from their husbands, the affection of children for their parents. You have stolen lives and property. Speak for yourself dear and be honest. For you have lied and taught your followers to lie also. I have no interest in going back and forth with you like this. There are tons of things I could say but to no avail. I have wondered how you could really do what you have done. I wondered if you had Alzheimer's or what could possibly be your problem. I’ve wondered, “Does he really believe what he’s doing is true or is he just a good scammer”. You have followed the path of every deceiver before you, taking everyone’s property and sleeping with the women. And you just want us to keep our mouth shut about it? You’re the one that’s nuts.
Julie
Sincerely,
Wayne
PS I have paid tithes and offering to you for the last 18 years and I would like to have it back. Thank you And please,
do not write me again. My email address was not to be given to anyone.
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To Whom It May Concern August 2007
To Whom it May Concern:
I am writing this as a public declaration. I was in the Lord Our Righteousness church for 18 years and just left approximately a year ago. I am writing this in an effort to share some things I witnessed during my time with the Travessers and some thoughts and conclusions I've come to since then. Wayne Bent has made many claims to which I gave credence to in the beginning, however now I see them as untrue. What I see is that he has followed the pattern of "every man who thinks he's god" that has gone before him.
I made the decision to stop attending the meetings about 1 1/2 years ago and it was at that time that things began to open up to me. It was as if my head began to clear and I was able to stand back and begin putting things together. We had been taught so many things over the years and as I prayed for guidance a picture began to open up to me. Even now as I read the things Wayne writes, I find them to be a very incredible story. If you take his stories at face value they can be very believable. My problem was that I was there for the first five years on the land and after that 1 year of reading the posts and going to meetings. One thing that Wayne taught us was not to think. "Do not think", he would say. But I started thinking - and adding. My addition sums were not adding up the same as his though.
Wayne talks of God's miracles in separating the witnesses from their husbands and marrying them to himself. And the miracles of the seven virgins laying naked with him. That would be a nice story if you didn't know what lay under it. For the first five years we were repeatedly, OVER and OVER, constantly barraged in written form as well as in meetings with the message that the marriages were over. The only marriage left was with God and he was god. It takes an absolute imbecile to not get it, at least eventually. Even in one meeting Wayne singled out two people, my husband and "D". He told them they were not married to their spouses. Some people (because they already didn't like their husbands) separated sooner than others. I never left my husband though. It was never in my heart to leave him. I loved him. Unfortunately my husband believed Wayne and that separation was the right thing to do. What happened with us was that after we moved off the land, we became extremely assaulted with "separating from your spouse and moving back to the land" until I couldn't handle it anymore. I made a stand that I wasn't going to do that and I ceased going to the meetings. The effect was that now I was on the "outside" and my husband was left being the one assaulted since I wouldn't accept the assaults any longer. "T" believed it was of God though, and he finally left me 2 years later. He has his stories about why he left but three weeks before he moved, he told me he loved me. Then a week later, after being smashed in a letter from Wayne, he told me he didn't love me and was going to pray for me to get a boyfriend in the hope that I would leave him. He even admitted to me that he had "taken the hit" for 2 more years after I quit "taking the hit", thinking it was a great spiritual achievement.
There was something that was a bit of an enigma to me. I couldn't understand this for the longest time - why the difference between how Wayne acted to your face and the aggressiveness of the posts (the posts were his writings given to the church). Wayne was seemingly sweet to your face and very able to explain away any problems you brought him. But the posts were almost like the opposite. For instance, he would tell you to your face that it was well for you to remain with your spouse and then he would write a letter to the church slamming people that remained with their spouses. It was almost as if they were two different people. I had a feeling deep within me that it was a huge psychological game but couldn't understand "why". Then I watched the things that occurred between Wayne and others that were not living on the land and put it all together with how he dealt with those on the land. There was a family that were drifting away and they began to say a few things. When Wayne heard what they were saying he sent them a very fiery letter and I watched the effect on them. It sent them into absolute despair. They still believed that he was God and now they had been bad. They were cut off and were dead and lost. They went running to him and he patted them on the back and told them everything was okay for they were on the right path again. They were then ensnared with him again, some people were more so than others. As I watched this process, I thought it looked a lot like fishing. Snaring this fish and dragging him around with a hook stuck in his face.
Back to when I was on the land, we used to have a joke. "Did you get posted?"- in other words you were slapped with a post. It was never funny though. Anytime anyone stepped out of line or did anything contrary to how Wayne saw life, a public post was written about you. In a meeting, a friend, "J", was giving a testimony and casually mentioned that it felt like Wayne had beat him up. Wayne then said, "Oh no, "J" you weren't beaten up, you were loved". No, really he was beaten up and so were we. We were psychologically beaten up until most of us did not step out of line anymore. I finally came to the place where I couldn't take part in it any longer. I saw the psychological power he has held over us. People so desperately have wanted his approval that they do just about anything to get it. What a sad thing for a man to hold this power over another human being. I concluded that God doesn't do these things. I thought, "What happened to faith in God? What happened to listening only to the voice within you?"
Going back to the miracle of the 2 witnesses. Wayne has his great story how the husbands gave their wives over to him. Really though, the only reason those husbands gave their wives over ("T" more so than "J") was pure psychological DURESS. During that process I didn't understand what was going on, until I was barraged so heavily later. "T" would get up in church and bawl every Sabbath giving his testimony and Wayne would talk week after week about "Pharaoh" with the hard heart that wouldn't let his people go (meaning his wife). "T" would give her a writing of divorcement and then take it back, give it and take it back. Until he finally submitted. "T" had a very hard time and I am truly sorry for a being a part of it. After he had a time of healing, probably a year or 2, in one of our meetings Wayne came in all humble and said "how he saw that he had split up the marriages and families and now everyone was lonely". Oh, he was so weepy over it. And everyone said, "Oh, thats okay Michael (Wayne), we are happy for what you have done." As I look back on that event, I see the psychological maneuver in getting their agreement for what happened. It was like a set-up. If you were to ask "T" about these events he would stick up for Wayne and everything that happened to the end and then repent that he hadn't submitted sooner.
Now, I'd like to talk a little about the virgins. My husband recently told me that this happened to offend and shake out anyone who could be offended. All I could think was, "what a bunch of BS". No, he just wanted to sleep with the girls. When most of the people in the church accepted this I thought they were absolute lunatics. But then, I hadn't been getting my brain washed for about 6 months. Or maybe, I thought, someone came in the middle of the night and sucked their brains out. I had been with these girls since they were little. My boys grew up with them. Again, I watched the things that happened with the girls over the years. I knew they had been "groomed" to take up this "work" of theirs. Wayne had totally cut off their hopes for having any relationships or marriages. They were in their teens through their early 20's during this time. Remember the meetings consisted of "no more marriages, only with him and God". Wayne also constantly talked during this last seven years of "being naked with God". Does anyone need an IQ test here? The girls in their testimonies talked about how they needed to be naked with God to get rid of the barriers and fears they had. Wayne is the one that has created the barriers and fears for them and everyone else. Again I thought, "What happened to faith in God? What happened to Martin Luther's 95 thesis? Living by faith and not works. You have to get naked with a man to know you are accepted and forgiven by God???" Isn't that what the cross was for, to reconcile us to God?
To add to all this, as I Iooked over our church history and started putting things together, I could see how Wayne always watched over those girls and repelled any boyfriends, even before we came here to New Mexico. As if he was saving them for himself. I feel that this is where he has always been going. It's just that now has been the time he finally had the church in a position to accept these things. Also, as I reflected over the past seven years, there was one girl who always came before my mind. That was "A". I could see her face in the meetings and I have had a gut feeling that she always knew she was going to have to sleep with Wayne from the earliest time. I could see the meeting we had when Wayne first announced the consummation. He said it may be with everyone. And as I was spiritualizing it away, "A" was crying. After the meeting, he drew her aside and at that time I was sure he was reassuring her that it wasn't with her. But now I know in my heart he most likely wasn't. What happened with our little girls was that they just finally submitted to what seemed to be the inevitable for them. I would like to apologize to the girls for having any part in this and I would also like to apologize for their own mothers and fathers for they really do not know what they are doing. We always thought we were doing "God's service" but it was the pagans that gave their virgin daughters to "sleep" with the gods.
The next topic is "W". I just found out about Wayne's sexual affair with "W" this spring. I was quite astounded by it and my husbands "oh well" attitude. His sleeping with "W" totally went against everything he said in the beginning with the witnesses. He claimed with the witnesses that there would only be ONE consummation, like there was ONE cross. He also claimed that "W" begged him for 2 months to sleep with him. My question is, "Why didn't he sleep with "C", she begged him for months?" The obvious thing is that "C" is the same age as himself, mid 60's, and not as beautiful. Sorry "C". Another thing I learned was that Wayne had been hitting on "W" since Florida before she married his son, "J". So visibly so, that one of the church ministers had to have a talk with him to tell him to knock it off. So, there was one more consummation and now Wayne has three witnesses.
Tell me again, how many times did Jesus have to die on the cross?
There really is a lot more I could say and I have been wanting to say these things for a long time but haven't because of my husband. Just to be clear, I no longer believe that Wayne is the Messiah. In fact, I think he has scammed us in more ways than one. I believe that Wayne is a sick man and just loves to be worshiped. My intuition tells me that there is a lot of dirt under the carpet that hasn't been seen, even though it's all vacuumed and pretty. My husband came home from a meeting one day, and he said "Wayne told us he was the devil" and I thought to myself, yes, I think he's pretty right on.
Sincerely,
Julie Czapiewski
Note: I didn't use people's full names except Wayne.
Note from the Editor:
I just wanted to add my agreement with Julie. I was also there, and I also witnessed the same things. Prudence Welch
I am writing this as a public declaration. I was in the Lord Our Righteousness church for 18 years and just left approximately a year ago. I am writing this in an effort to share some things I witnessed during my time with the Travessers and some thoughts and conclusions I've come to since then. Wayne Bent has made many claims to which I gave credence to in the beginning, however now I see them as untrue. What I see is that he has followed the pattern of "every man who thinks he's god" that has gone before him.
I made the decision to stop attending the meetings about 1 1/2 years ago and it was at that time that things began to open up to me. It was as if my head began to clear and I was able to stand back and begin putting things together. We had been taught so many things over the years and as I prayed for guidance a picture began to open up to me. Even now as I read the things Wayne writes, I find them to be a very incredible story. If you take his stories at face value they can be very believable. My problem was that I was there for the first five years on the land and after that 1 year of reading the posts and going to meetings. One thing that Wayne taught us was not to think. "Do not think", he would say. But I started thinking - and adding. My addition sums were not adding up the same as his though.
Wayne talks of God's miracles in separating the witnesses from their husbands and marrying them to himself. And the miracles of the seven virgins laying naked with him. That would be a nice story if you didn't know what lay under it. For the first five years we were repeatedly, OVER and OVER, constantly barraged in written form as well as in meetings with the message that the marriages were over. The only marriage left was with God and he was god. It takes an absolute imbecile to not get it, at least eventually. Even in one meeting Wayne singled out two people, my husband and "D". He told them they were not married to their spouses. Some people (because they already didn't like their husbands) separated sooner than others. I never left my husband though. It was never in my heart to leave him. I loved him. Unfortunately my husband believed Wayne and that separation was the right thing to do. What happened with us was that after we moved off the land, we became extremely assaulted with "separating from your spouse and moving back to the land" until I couldn't handle it anymore. I made a stand that I wasn't going to do that and I ceased going to the meetings. The effect was that now I was on the "outside" and my husband was left being the one assaulted since I wouldn't accept the assaults any longer. "T" believed it was of God though, and he finally left me 2 years later. He has his stories about why he left but three weeks before he moved, he told me he loved me. Then a week later, after being smashed in a letter from Wayne, he told me he didn't love me and was going to pray for me to get a boyfriend in the hope that I would leave him. He even admitted to me that he had "taken the hit" for 2 more years after I quit "taking the hit", thinking it was a great spiritual achievement.
There was something that was a bit of an enigma to me. I couldn't understand this for the longest time - why the difference between how Wayne acted to your face and the aggressiveness of the posts (the posts were his writings given to the church). Wayne was seemingly sweet to your face and very able to explain away any problems you brought him. But the posts were almost like the opposite. For instance, he would tell you to your face that it was well for you to remain with your spouse and then he would write a letter to the church slamming people that remained with their spouses. It was almost as if they were two different people. I had a feeling deep within me that it was a huge psychological game but couldn't understand "why". Then I watched the things that occurred between Wayne and others that were not living on the land and put it all together with how he dealt with those on the land. There was a family that were drifting away and they began to say a few things. When Wayne heard what they were saying he sent them a very fiery letter and I watched the effect on them. It sent them into absolute despair. They still believed that he was God and now they had been bad. They were cut off and were dead and lost. They went running to him and he patted them on the back and told them everything was okay for they were on the right path again. They were then ensnared with him again, some people were more so than others. As I watched this process, I thought it looked a lot like fishing. Snaring this fish and dragging him around with a hook stuck in his face.
Back to when I was on the land, we used to have a joke. "Did you get posted?"- in other words you were slapped with a post. It was never funny though. Anytime anyone stepped out of line or did anything contrary to how Wayne saw life, a public post was written about you. In a meeting, a friend, "J", was giving a testimony and casually mentioned that it felt like Wayne had beat him up. Wayne then said, "Oh no, "J" you weren't beaten up, you were loved". No, really he was beaten up and so were we. We were psychologically beaten up until most of us did not step out of line anymore. I finally came to the place where I couldn't take part in it any longer. I saw the psychological power he has held over us. People so desperately have wanted his approval that they do just about anything to get it. What a sad thing for a man to hold this power over another human being. I concluded that God doesn't do these things. I thought, "What happened to faith in God? What happened to listening only to the voice within you?"
Going back to the miracle of the 2 witnesses. Wayne has his great story how the husbands gave their wives over to him. Really though, the only reason those husbands gave their wives over ("T" more so than "J") was pure psychological DURESS. During that process I didn't understand what was going on, until I was barraged so heavily later. "T" would get up in church and bawl every Sabbath giving his testimony and Wayne would talk week after week about "Pharaoh" with the hard heart that wouldn't let his people go (meaning his wife). "T" would give her a writing of divorcement and then take it back, give it and take it back. Until he finally submitted. "T" had a very hard time and I am truly sorry for a being a part of it. After he had a time of healing, probably a year or 2, in one of our meetings Wayne came in all humble and said "how he saw that he had split up the marriages and families and now everyone was lonely". Oh, he was so weepy over it. And everyone said, "Oh, thats okay Michael (Wayne), we are happy for what you have done." As I look back on that event, I see the psychological maneuver in getting their agreement for what happened. It was like a set-up. If you were to ask "T" about these events he would stick up for Wayne and everything that happened to the end and then repent that he hadn't submitted sooner.
Now, I'd like to talk a little about the virgins. My husband recently told me that this happened to offend and shake out anyone who could be offended. All I could think was, "what a bunch of BS". No, he just wanted to sleep with the girls. When most of the people in the church accepted this I thought they were absolute lunatics. But then, I hadn't been getting my brain washed for about 6 months. Or maybe, I thought, someone came in the middle of the night and sucked their brains out. I had been with these girls since they were little. My boys grew up with them. Again, I watched the things that happened with the girls over the years. I knew they had been "groomed" to take up this "work" of theirs. Wayne had totally cut off their hopes for having any relationships or marriages. They were in their teens through their early 20's during this time. Remember the meetings consisted of "no more marriages, only with him and God". Wayne also constantly talked during this last seven years of "being naked with God". Does anyone need an IQ test here? The girls in their testimonies talked about how they needed to be naked with God to get rid of the barriers and fears they had. Wayne is the one that has created the barriers and fears for them and everyone else. Again I thought, "What happened to faith in God? What happened to Martin Luther's 95 thesis? Living by faith and not works. You have to get naked with a man to know you are accepted and forgiven by God???" Isn't that what the cross was for, to reconcile us to God?
To add to all this, as I Iooked over our church history and started putting things together, I could see how Wayne always watched over those girls and repelled any boyfriends, even before we came here to New Mexico. As if he was saving them for himself. I feel that this is where he has always been going. It's just that now has been the time he finally had the church in a position to accept these things. Also, as I reflected over the past seven years, there was one girl who always came before my mind. That was "A". I could see her face in the meetings and I have had a gut feeling that she always knew she was going to have to sleep with Wayne from the earliest time. I could see the meeting we had when Wayne first announced the consummation. He said it may be with everyone. And as I was spiritualizing it away, "A" was crying. After the meeting, he drew her aside and at that time I was sure he was reassuring her that it wasn't with her. But now I know in my heart he most likely wasn't. What happened with our little girls was that they just finally submitted to what seemed to be the inevitable for them. I would like to apologize to the girls for having any part in this and I would also like to apologize for their own mothers and fathers for they really do not know what they are doing. We always thought we were doing "God's service" but it was the pagans that gave their virgin daughters to "sleep" with the gods.
The next topic is "W". I just found out about Wayne's sexual affair with "W" this spring. I was quite astounded by it and my husbands "oh well" attitude. His sleeping with "W" totally went against everything he said in the beginning with the witnesses. He claimed with the witnesses that there would only be ONE consummation, like there was ONE cross. He also claimed that "W" begged him for 2 months to sleep with him. My question is, "Why didn't he sleep with "C", she begged him for months?" The obvious thing is that "C" is the same age as himself, mid 60's, and not as beautiful. Sorry "C". Another thing I learned was that Wayne had been hitting on "W" since Florida before she married his son, "J". So visibly so, that one of the church ministers had to have a talk with him to tell him to knock it off. So, there was one more consummation and now Wayne has three witnesses.
Tell me again, how many times did Jesus have to die on the cross?
There really is a lot more I could say and I have been wanting to say these things for a long time but haven't because of my husband. Just to be clear, I no longer believe that Wayne is the Messiah. In fact, I think he has scammed us in more ways than one. I believe that Wayne is a sick man and just loves to be worshiped. My intuition tells me that there is a lot of dirt under the carpet that hasn't been seen, even though it's all vacuumed and pretty. My husband came home from a meeting one day, and he said "Wayne told us he was the devil" and I thought to myself, yes, I think he's pretty right on.
Sincerely,
Julie Czapiewski
Note: I didn't use people's full names except Wayne.
Note from the Editor:
I just wanted to add my agreement with Julie. I was also there, and I also witnessed the same things. Prudence Welch
Wayne's Response with Julie's Comments
Hello Julie,
I truly appreciate being able to read the letter from you against me, that was posted on the Prudence attack page. I do not appreciate it because of the content, but because you have never, ever, spoken with me about these things, but it is evident that you have quite a strong opinion, as strong as you say that my opinion is. I would say this: Julie, why did you not speak to me in person, ever, about your offenses, but you would only speak to the world? What good would it have done to talk to you? Would you have repented? No, you are always the “right one” Wayne. You are a true-blue manipulator. It’s your way or the highway (or hell, however you want to put it).
Should I not be privileged to face my accuser? You never once told me these things to my face, or in writing. Not one single time. So now, you go to the public airwaves to spread your stories, almost completely erroneous in regard to the context. Some of your information is plainly untrue. You accuse me of hitting on W. before she was married. What a pure falsehood. It was told to me by the person that reprimanded you. What you were doing with Wendy was seen by several people there. I don’t believe you are telling the truth. You never once asked me if these things were true. Would you have admitted it? Julie, do not the Scriptures say that if one has an offense that they should go to the one that they are offended in? Then, if he does not hear, take another one with you. Then, if he does not hear, bring the matter before the church? Isn't that right Julie? So why did you not come to me? And why did you refuse to visit with me when I offered? So now you pretend to keep the scriptures. What about: But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, causes her to become an adulteress, and anyone who marries the divorced woman commits adultery; or
Do not have sexual relations with your daughter-in-law. She is your son’s wife; or You shall not commit adultery; or You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife. You were always a stickler about the 4th commandment to honor the Sabbath day but you have disregarded the 7th and the 10th commandments.
Eighteen years, Julie. Eighteen years? And you never said anything to me in eighteen years? If I knew this 18 years ago, I wouldn’t have been here that long. It’s only been the last year I’ve come to see what you are doing. I have not held back but told everything plainly to my husband. Please excuse me, but something sounds very strange here. You accuse me of deception, but I think it was you who were deceiving me. You, Prudence, and others, have plainly put together a wonderful fabrication and distortion, to support your very offended hearts. You speak of "taking a hit." Julie, the only time you may have "taken a hit" was when you told me that you were falling in love with me, and out of love with your husband. Remember Julie? Remember, I told you to go back to your husband and be a good wife. Is that not true, Julie? Yes, it is absolutely true. I wanted to have nothing to do with another man's wife. Well, you went back to your husband and that was just what I asked you to do. You have managed to cover all your bases, Wayne. We all know, those of us who spent many hours in meetings, that you did tell us to go back to our husbands, but that was not your intention. And you openly stated this. That was another one of your little reverse psychologies. Your true intention was for the wives to leave their husbands and come to you. You would still always have your alibi - “I told them to go back to their husbands”. Remember, you always set the 2 witnesses up as an example to follow, and they left their husbands.
But there is another aspect to this and since you’ve opened it up let’s talk about it. Yes, (seemingly) falling in love with you was what happened with all the women including myself. It was very short lived though. This led me to see that it was purely a response to the attentions you were giving to me and the other women. And I considered all these things after I stopped going to the meetings. You said it was such a miracle - the witnesses leaving their husbands. But what happened is that you stole the affections of the wives right out in front of the husband’s noses. I witnessed it and experienced it myself. You repeatedly told the husbands that they needed to give their wives over to you and you meant it. I realized that if any man on this earth stood up and said and did the things you did, the women would have fallen in love with him, left their husbands, and would want to sleep with him. Men become rock stars to “get the chicks”. You just became a star in your own mind and projected that to everyone else.
You sure seem to know a whale of a lot about my motives without ever once having spoken with me about them. Does that not seem a little strange, even to you? You also seem to know the motivations of people. Do you think you are the only one that understands how people work? You seem to know all about me, but you have never asked me. How is it that you know so much now, when I have not told you? How is it you know so much without being told?
And Julie, for years, over and over again, I said to ask Father, the God of heaven, if I am who I say that I am. Everyone went and asked God, and everyone was satisfied that God told them that I came from Him. Was not this true? Yes, it was true. So God either told you that I was from Him, or you lied in order to stay here with us. Which was it Julie? Did you lie, or did God tell you I was from Him? No, he did not tell me. I trusted your testimony. It is your fruit and not your words that tell me you are false now. In the old days you would be called a "smooth talker". You have the ability to convince people that what you are doing is of God even when you are swiping their wife right out from under them. It wasn't until last year when the vision (at that time) was for you to have sexual relations with the seven young women that I saw you were really off base. This is important to me. Did your friend Prudence lie to me also? She was asked years ago, as you were, to go ask God also. If I am a deceiver, then why didn't your God tell you? Shecaniah told me a story a few years ago. The Father in heaven told her to go see you in your little retreat. When she got there, you plainly told her that it was not God that told her to go there. So, how does she know which voice is true? You have made it so that they don’t even know which voice is true. They only listen to the voice that comes out of your mouth without any rhyme or reason - even when it’s against the very scriptures they have claimed to follow.
And Julie, why is it that Helen still has a husband and children, and she and her husband David, happily come to meetings when we have them? She is rejoicing daily for her deliverance. How could this be if I told everyone to leave their husbands or wives? You are simply becoming a victim of your illusions. Vickie left her husband and children to live on the land 2 years ago at the bidding of your posts. She finally went back to live with her husband because she missed him. She also told me that her and David wanted to live on the land and your instruction to them was that they could if they put their children in foster care. Another family told me that that was your instruction to them also. You want to know weird, that is weird. If she wants to be a part of your manipulations and in agreement with you sleeping with the girls, that’s fine. I do not. I am rejoicing in my deliverance also.
I spoke with your husband a little bit ago. He read your letter of accusation also. He told me that you are not reporting things as they happened between you and him. You have distorted things he has said, to be something other than what they were. I have witnesses that testify to the truth of what I am saying. He also told me you stole some tools from him when you left, that you had promised to give back. Julie, is stealing okay with you? Stealing? It’s called division of property. He gave all his carpentry tools (25 years worth), his car and his money to who? TO YOU. I kept the router to use here. He didn’t need it there since he has internet. Besides, Terry kept plenty of things. If I could have kept it all, I would have. I have no interest in supporting you in any manner. I’ve done that long enough.
Here’s a question for you? Is stealing ok with you? You accuse me of stealing a $75 router when you have stolen my companion and friend.
And not just mine, but many other companions. He was my helper and friend for 16 years. He was of far more value to me than a $75 router.
You say, “I haven’t stolen him, he left of his own accord”. You are a liar, Wayne. I know how you did it. You can get away with it with those that don’t understand what happened and those that willingly cover their eyes, but I know.
Also, since we’re on the subject, Terry asked me if he could have our electric blanket if I didn’t have a need for it. I told him that I do. I get cold sleeping by myself in the winter, even here. I would suggest that since my husband gave you everything he owns that you buy an electric blanket for him for the winter - since he will be sleeping, as many do, in an unheated facility. Oh, and one more thing, just so we can be clear and honest. I told Terry that I wanted the set of speakers but he really wanted them. He was in the process of getting the Jeep ready to sell. I told him to buy himself a new set when he sold the Jeep. He said “I can’t, because the money is all Wayne’s” So maybe, you could throw in a set of speakers too. Expensive ones, not the cheapies. Thanks!!
Is your theft okay, but my "crimes" not okay? He also stated that he didn't leave your house because of me, or because of anything I said. Oh no, of course not!! He told me that he left because your spirit had changed. A darkness had come over you, and he had to leave that darkness behind. He said that you were an enemy of his family, and he could not live with that any longer. Yes, he left because I dared to openly go against what you were doing. And that you call darkness.
Dear Julie, you accuse me of deception, but it is you who are guilty of that. I have deceived no one, but you have. This is a very sorry thing on my heart for you. Please, spare me. You have a very fine act. Cannot you just be honest, and tell the truth, without making up all of these fabricated distortions? Is Prudence, your "best friend," your new cult leader now? I wonder this because Prudence seems fixated on cults.
Julie, I found no fault in you for leaving us. I never once accosted you about it. I never even one single time, told you that you were evil. No, not once. I have always said to the people, and you know this, "I want you to follow your heart." "Do what you want." And I was content with letting you do what you wanted. But Julie, I didn't mean lie, distort, and hide from the truth of things. I never said to be a devil. I never meant for you to go into hell and spread falsehoods. I said that one should always do what God told him to do. This is true, isn't it Julie? Yes, it is true.
Elisha shared that you have always been afraid. Everyone out there is afraid of you. That’s why A. said she needed to be naked with you, to get over her fears. But I’m not afraid of you anymore. You’re just a skinny little old man that is extremely long winded and with an ego and an imagination that’s just as long. Isn't it true that "perfect love casts out all fear?" Is fear part of the god you have now? I never, ever, taught you to be afraid. I do not believe in fearing. So why am I blamed for that? How is it that you blame me for things that I have never, ever, done to you? What is motivating you? I have never, ever, confronted you about anything. I never have until this very day. I never, ever, told your husband to leave you, or that you should leave him. You are so full of BS it’s incredible. So, are you telling me that is wasn’t you that wrote the posts? In fact, I told you to stay with him. Is that not true? I have never made the doctrine of leaving one's spouse. I have only said that one should divorce his offenses. One should leave the fighting and tension. The reality and the fruit of everything you have said is that no one on the land has an earthly spouse. They have only done as you have preached. Are you lying, even to yourself? Yes, I did say one should divorce from those things. So why are you making up all of your phantoms and accusing me of them? Why? I have never, ever, treated you in a way that would cause fear. Little children love me, and NO, I have not molested them. Children do not love someone they are afraid of, but you have not loved me, evidenced by your fear of me.
So why do you accuse me of things, that you are actually guilty of? That is, "sneaking around making people believe things that are untrue." It is you who are doing that, not I. I tell everyone exactly what I do and I invite anyone, anytime, to come and speak to me about anything. Do you do this Julie? No, you don't do this. You hide and spread "evil surmising." Is evil surmising okay in your new religion, Julie, the religion of Prudence? Have you joined the church of Prudence? Old friend, you think you have left the cult of fear, but you have only joined it. No, my dear, I haven’t. You have given a false view of life to your flock, especially to the young children, in order to keep them in bondage. When you hosted those men who came to put signs on our fence, to curse us, you acted from a dark spirit and not the spirit of Christ. I have written the men who came, and none of them will answer me. They are hiding in a crack somewhere because their evil deeds were exposed. This little episode amazed me. I had nothing to do with the men writing the curses against you. The amazing thing was the offense I saw coming from you and my dear husband. You have cursed the world and waited for the plagues to fall on it for its wickedness for years now. And yet, when 2 men come with signs to curse you for your wickedness and call down the plagues - my oh my, it couldn’t possibly be true. What I did was give the men a place to rest, that’s all. And so, at the very time you are praying for the end of the world, the plagues to fall on all mankind, and for your own translation - 2 men come and put a sign of curses on your gate. So what happened? Did the world end? no Did the plagues fall? no Did you translate? no. You make up stories that these things happen but they really don’t. The reality of what you received was 2 men came and cursed you. So make up your stories. You might have taken it down in 10 minutes but the truth is that God isn’t a respecter of persons, not even you. And he’s not superstitious. If a man does wickedly he will get what he gets. Hitler and Stalin went on their murderous way for quite a long time before they were stopped. A thunderbolt didn’t come down and hit them on the head. They could not even be honest and open, but they had to sneak down the road in the dark with their lights off. But Father awakened one to go see, and we observed the whole sneaky affair. She always wakes up at that time in the morning. When they saw my little flashlight coming, they ran off into the night slithering away in the darkness. God told me right then, "They have cursed whom I have not cursed so their curse will be upon their own heads." Their sign lasted about 10 minutes. The Father alerted us against their voodoo, and said that their voodoo would go upon their own heads.
Julie, whether or not you belong to my church is not a concern to me, but I would very much love for you to find Christ. Yes, anywhere, Christ is a fire. Jesus said that he turned households against each other. You have said that anyone can make the scriptures say what they want and that is what you have done also. He said he came to bring a fire. It is not enjoyable to the flesh to receive Christ. It is sometimes a terror to the flesh, but I would wish upon you this holy terror of the Son of God. With it comes security, fearlessness, and openness. I would very much wish upon you an honest heart instead of the one you now possess. I would wish the same things for Prudence also. When you know God, you will know all about me then, instead of the manufactured vision of me that comes from the dark world below. Be honest, old friend, and return your husband's tools to him. Stealing is not the way to heaven. No, Wayne, that’s true. Stealing isn’t the way to heaven. And you have stolen much. You have stolen the affection of wives from their husbands, the affection of children for their parents. You have stolen lives and property. Speak for yourself dear and be honest. For you have lied and taught your followers to lie also. I have no interest in going back and forth with you like this. There are tons of things I could say but to no avail. I have wondered how you could really do what you have done. I wondered if you had Alzheimer's or what could possibly be your problem. I’ve wondered, “Does he really believe what he’s doing is true or is he just a good scammer”. You have followed the path of every deceiver before you, taking everyone’s property and sleeping with the women. And you just want us to keep our mouth shut about it? You’re the one that’s nuts.
Julie
Sincerely,
Wayne
PS I have paid tithes and offering to you for the last 18 years and I would like to have it back. Thank you And please,
do not write me again. My email address was not to be given to anyone.